Chaitali, yes this is something that we really need to think about. Will be back later

Chaitali

You've put a very interesting spin on this story. I guess this is a complex issue. On one hand I totally agree with you when you say that secularism can and does lead to divisionalism and that there is actually always a larger majority which thrives and perpetuates its interests under the safety net of a secular state.

However when it comes to Muslims I think there is a slightly different problem in addressing issues. Over the years Muslims have become very beligerent about their religion, their identity and their 'own' laws and I think frankly people are just increasingly scared to take them on, because they are increasingly intolerant of other views and opinions, especially when it comes to what they consider 'mine and our own'.

The debate however that you raise stands valid but I'm just not sure what the alternative is when one deals with groups which are so non-secular in their thought process????

Hello people
Rolled into ur site by accident. Great discussions. BTW Chaitali what is really sad is the way the media then makes it look like these women are dying to comply by the Shariat ruling and its all very kosher in the end. Saaaaad m'dear but as you say its so much easier to just let 'them ' deal with it since no one is really listening to any other opinion.

Hey came thru ur Rakhi Sawant post. Liked it!

cheers

Mehak I quite agree with you. Mein apki baat se sehmat hoon. I'm not media bashing as such because at times the media does manage to bring important issues on the forefront (though these days that is very very rare). But it is true that even if we look at the media's manner of reporting such stories there is a tendency to just reestablish, without any attempt at questioning, the inclusiveness of the Muslim community as Anusheh has stated.

They are just further strengthening the view that already most people hold about the Muslim women being subjected to discrimination by the religious clerics. But koi bhi attempt nahin kar raha hain ki iss baat ko ek do kadam aur agey bara kar rights as a citizen, jo ki Chaitali ne mention kiya hain, ki aur le chale. There is n attempt to move beyond the religious issue to the issue of rights as a citizen as a human being. There are a few attempts here and there but very half hearted.

Anusheh I guess the most obvious answer would be the much debated Uniform Civil Code. But then every inclusive group is fearful that it will lose its 'identity' and power. So people are really not concerned about dignity, respect etc but about power. It's a shame but reality as it exists.

I think people also need to buck up and voice their opinion. I know for many it is tough because they are in an environment where raising ones voice against the leaders and tradition means death, extermination from their community, village etc. Par kahin se to shuruat karni hogi! To kyun na hum khud apne mind se shuru kare where we try to avoid this disctinction.

Sometimes I wonder with so much of inclusiveness/excluviness where does the slogan 'Unity in Diversity' stand? I don't see any Unity these days but more and more Diversity and with it chaos, confusion and every group trying to build a wall around it, creating its own laws.

Hi Mehak, Simran, Anusheh,

I know that this is a very complex issue and has been again and again debated upon by many. But these are questions that comes into my mind everytime I hear about such incidents and the reponses of people to it.

It is wrong to say that a particular religion thrives on inequality. It is inequality that thrives on religion. One has to fight this inequality and not the religion. I think this is what most of us seem to miss out on and end up bashing religion.

When people will not change what can other do? It is there repsonsibility to not make their women slaves and let them out of burqa. what can we do when they tell us we are kafeers. why should we interfere then?

Mili

Mili,

If that is the case then when as a women when you face injustice and scream out to the world to bring you justice many people and here I mean men can turn around and say 'why should we care. it's you women's problems not ours.' But thats not the case is it?

Par haan, women need to also fight it out and not quitely sucumb to any injustice.

My dear sisters(especially Mili and Chaitali):
I am a Muslim born in Kashmir,i m 18 and when i was born the turmoil winds had already started blowing here.Now whether all that this started for was right or wrong i dont know and personally i think it was not justified..Dear Mili but what the question to be answered is whatever that is happening here right now,whether that is wrong or right.You know since 2000 there have been about 300 disappearences and more than 200 rapes and in every case indian army personnels are involved..Every day we hear our sisters being raped and brothers being killed and that too without any reason.Miss Chaitali i have read many of your articles and i m very impressed by the way you present yourself,but let me tell you,you write just for the sake of writing without analyzing the situation.If you think you are really concerned about human rights then why dont you stand up and fight for Kashmiri women,is it b'coz they are getting raped by Indian officers.Dont u think that your above article is just written for the sake of writing.Dear Chaitali i dont want to critisize ur ideology but if you take human rights as your topic,dont try to express what you feel,express what is true and pragmatic.Ok tell me does our indian law in any way give justice to the mothers of the disappeared Kashmiris,although they have evidence for every crime?.I m a common kashmiri help me damn it..This is where u give birth to 'us and them' not we..And Miss Mili our India burns in riots because there are some selfish people and selfish can be a Muslim as well as a Hindu..Sister Mili u need to read the works of Arundhati Roy,she is also a Hindu girl but to us she is dearer than our sister coz she,although with her pen,is fighting for a right cause...Please forgive me if i offended anyone..May Allah bless us all.

My dear sisters(especially Mili and Chaitali):
I am a Muslim born in Kashmir,i m 18 and when i was born the turmoil winds had already started blowing here.Now whether all that this started for was right or wrong i dont know and personally i think it was not justified..Dear Mili but what the question to be answered is whatever that is happening here right now,whether that is wrong or right.You know since 2000 there have been about 300 disappearences and more than 200 rapes and in every case indian army personnels are involved..Every day we hear our sisters being raped and brothers being killed and that too without any reason.Miss Chaitali i have read many of your articles and i m very impressed by the way you present yourself,but let me tell you,you write just for the sake of writing without analyzing the situation.If you think you are really concerned about human rights then why dont you stand up and fight for Kashmiri women,is it b'coz they are getting raped by Indian officers.Dont u think that your above article is just written for the sake of writing.Dear Chaitali i dont want to critisize ur ideology but if you take human rights as your topic,dont try to express what you feel,express what is true and pragmatic.Ok tell me does our indian law in any way give justice to the mothers of the disappeared Kashmiris,although they have evidence for every crime?.I m a common kashmiri help me damn it..This is where u give birth to 'us and them' not we..And Miss Mili our India burns in riots because there are some selfish people and selfish can be a Muslim as well as a Hindu..Sister Mili u need to read the works of Arundhati Roy,she is also a Hindu girl but to us she is dearer than our sister coz she,although with her pen,is fighting for a right cause...Please forgive me if i offended anyone..May Allah bless us all.

Dear Khawar,

Definitely what is happening in Kashmir to many women and mothers is nothing but yet another example of what a sham Indian democracy is in. The examples that I have given in the article are only a few of the others. People are still being killed and humiliated in the name of caste, class, religion, region.

Everyone has their way of fighting for a cause. Arundhati Roy has her way. R.K laxman has his way. People writnig on this blog have their way. I'm not an activist but I make my voice heard even if it is to 3 or 4 people visiting the blog. That is my way of bringing forth the issue of injustice and human rights.

And no I have not written the article for the sake of writing. I write when something comes to my notice which deeply moves me. The story of Imrana came up in the newspaper one day and I wrote on it. But the article is not just about Imrana. If you read it carefully it is about injustice and discrimination against people in the name of democracy. You can replace Imrana, with a mother who has lost her son or daughter due to violation of human rights.

I would like to thank you for bringing up the issue of the violation of human rights in Kashmir. Few months back NDTV did an article on 'Missing Sons' and the story made me cry. But it also made me feel proud of this particualr mother who has been courageous enough to take up this cause and fight for rights.

We have an open forum on the blog. Go to archives and you'll find it. You can voice yourself on the forum too. THta is what this blog is all about.

Take care
Chaitali